. >> the whole thing about investing-- and obviously everybody's paying attention to the fiscal cliff. businesspeople i've talked to at this point are saying, listen, closing loopholes, raising rates, we don't care because if there is damage done there, it's much less than not reaching a deal. so reach a deal first. we don't even care anymore about this stuff, just get it done. but in terms of investing these days, you know, it's tough out there, of course. the idea is to be a contrarian, to think different. that's the only way, really, to get ahead over the long run. we have a story about jack bogel who has a company called vanguard, now $2.2 trillion colossus that he's built up by having low-cost index funds which people can't get their brains wrapped ar eped around, a really good strategy. we have a story about apple which is kind of the stock of our time. >> we asked the question, can you continue to be obsessed with apple stock? >> yes, i think you can. what's interesting about apple, and it's, again, sort of a contrarian position. a lot of people think the stock is really expens